By Gus Saltonstall
The New York City Department of Education has withdrawn multiple controversial proposals to close or relocate three schools on the Upper West Side for the start of the next school year, a spokesperson from the DOE confirmed to West Side Rag on Monday morning. The change was first reported by Chalkbeat.
Those proposals included the closure of the P.S. 191 Riverside School for Makers and Artists at 300 West 61st Street; the relocation of the Center School, from its building at 100 West 84th Street to the P.S. 191 building; and the truncation of the Manhattan School for Children middle school at 154 West 93rd Street.
All three of these proposals were slated to be voted on by the Panel of Education Policy (PEP) on Wednesday, a vote that will no longer take place.
“These proposals were always ambitious,” New York City Schools Chancellor Kamar Samuels told Chalkbeat. “I think when you have transition and you’re hearing simultaneously that families want more time, I want to be a chancellor who listens and engages and understands the complexity of all of the issues.”
The withdrawal of the proposals makes it close to a certainty that any changes to the three Upper West Side schools won’t take place next school year, but it is unclear whether the DOE will look to move forward with some versions of these proposals in the coming years.
Even if the DOE had not withdrawn the proposals, it is unclear if the changes would have been approved. Multiple PEP members had voiced concerns to West Side Rag about the Upper West Side school proposals, including at least one member who said that he would vote against the changes.
Samuels told Chalkbeat that the possibility that PEP could reject the proposals was not a factor in the decision to withdraw them. However, the education publication wrote, “But losing a high-profile vote could have complicated [Mayor] Mamdani’s campaign pledge to run the school system in a more democratic fashion.”
The DOE’s decision to withdraw the three remaining Upper West Side school proposals also comes around two months after it pulled the proposal to close the Community Action School middle school, also at 154 West 93rd Street, following “abhorrent remarks” made by a neighborhood parent as a child was speaking during a meeting.
Upper West Side City Councilmember Gale Brewer, who was slated to host a press conference on Monday morning calling to relocate the Center School to a building on West 85th Street (rather than to the West 61st Street address), released a statement following the DOE decision. Brewer said that the Center School still needs to focus on finding a new home, given the space concerns it has within the 100 West 84th Street building it shares with P.S. 9.
“Center School must find a new home,” Brewer wrote in a statement shared with West Side Rag. “As we know, the Center School community does not feel that the PS 191 building, a school that I was able to ‘build’ as part of the Riverside Center ULURP on West 61 Street, is in a place where they want to be for their educational model. Any future site for Center School will be discussed as part of the ongoing planning process.”
Read More:
- UWS Middle School with Focus on Students With Disabilities Fights Against Its Possible Eradication
- Member of Panel That Will Decide Fate of Three UWS Schools: ‘It Clearly Wasn’t Enough Time’
- City Halts Plan to Close Upper West Side Middle School: ‘Our Focus Must be on Healing’
- Racist Remarks Shock Participants at UWS Schools Meeting: ‘We Take These Matters Very Seriously’
- UWS Middle School Fights Against its Possible Elimination: ‘We Are Not Just Going to Roll Over’
- UWS Middle School Meets With DOE Reps to Discuss Possible Move: ‘We Want to be Heard’
- An UWS Middle School is Pushing Back Against Possible Relocation: ‘This School is Our Home
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This was a wise decision. Making changes like this at such a late date was a horrible idea. It was very unfair to those who had already made decisions and would have no way to change.
That being said, I completely agree with Ms. Brewer – some change is likely necessary. Rather than going into hibernation, immediate action should begin on resolving the situation in a more thoughtful way that looks at things from a big picture perspective. Hopefully a decision can be made by the fall so that plans for Fall 2027 can be made with sufficient notice. And hopefully we can work together on this rather than treating each other like enemies.
As I have suggested before, I think the obvious solution if the numbers work is moving Anderson elsewhere in the city rather than letting it have prime UWS real estate. It is a citywide school – people will travel to go there. It should not be a sacred cow. From what I understand, if they have to move, Center School parents would be happy to move to the Anderson space as it is nearby and has an adequate auditorium, which is critical to their curriculum. This seems like a win-win.
That building has 3 schools – it wasn’t even an option.
Why is that relevant? His suggestion is Anderson could move out, the other schools could stay, and Center move in. The building will need changes for the class size law anyway, so is the 3-year plan for one of those other schools to be pushed out or what?
I would love to know which, if any, public school your child(ren) attended. From what does your bizarre contempt for Anderson emanate?
I’m curious why you perceive Leon’s comment as having contempt for Anderson. He said that it’s a highly coveted citywide school that people are willing to travel to from all over, and so can be more easily moved than any district school. This is objectively true, and actually complimentary. It’s also objectively true that people talk about it as being untouchable. Saying that shouldn’t be the case (for any school) isn’t a show of contempt, either. There might be reasons not to move it, but the bizarre thing is your view that the suggestion shows contempt.
No contempt towards Anderson except I am tired of it being treated in a special way. This is the most practical solution. Special consideration should not be given to Anderson. I know it draws a large number of kids from the area but if this inconveniences them, they can switch to one of the excellent UWS Gen Ed or G&T schools. As I noted, hopefully this will be completed early so that if you don’t like it, you have plenty of time to switch.
It is all about compromise and this is the easiest one.
Whenever there is a potential merger/school closure in the southern part of D3, there are those who always point the finger at Anderson. Whenever there is a potential merger/school closure in the northern part of D3, no one mentions Anderson. Who, then, is truly the one expecting special treatment?You don’t (didn’t) want to be inconvenienced. You don’t (didn’t) want to compromise. Don’t put that on Anderson.
I called it in a previous post- these proposals were never going anywhere. It has been proved time and again that the DOE has no appetite for fighting rich and powerful parents such as those at Center. So far Kamar Samuels appears to be focused on appeasing them as well. Forget moving Anderson, never going to happen.
I would normally agree that the DOE usually bends to the rich and powerful. But, in this case, that’s PS9, not Center. Center is small and mixed bag of in terms of privilege. PS9 meanwhile is overwhelmingly white and raises $1m a year through the PA. But their whining was so abhorrent that there was no way the DOE was going to go in favor of them, especially when it involves such a vulnerable community like 191 getting displaced.
You should be embarrassed of yourself to write something like this. Center school and PS9 have almost the EXACT same demographics.
Thank you Leon. I am hopeful today that families across the district can advocate for the DOE to approach this with a coherent, full district plan. As has been said before, it’s known that there are other schools in the district that will need some change or another to meet the class size law. Given that many changes will be needed, it makes sense and builds trust in the public schools for there to be a plan that families can rely on when choosing schools, rather than piecemeal decisions that leave families wondering which school is next, and leads some families who can to opt out entirely.
I would love it if someone on here can explain why there arr all of these different schools?
Bloomberg wanted to triple, perhaps quadruple, the number of administrators so did so. No subsequent mayor ever bothered walking this back or even try to undo the damage Bloomberg wreaked on public schools. Worst mayor ever.
Michael Bloomberg
You have to hide those administrators somewhere.
“Despite 157,900 fewer students in DOE public schools in school year 2024-25, there were 39 more schools in operation, an increase from 1,580 in school year 2014-15 to 1,619 in school year 2024-25.”
https://cbcny.org/research/competitive-nyc#school
Because there are all of these different kids
The Manhattan Country School building on West 85th Street is vacant; perhaps it could be leased or purchased by the DoE.
Kamar Samuels himself, then Superintendent of D3 , along with members of the School Construction Authority toured the MCS building last year when the school was still open. They determined that it did not meet the criteria necessary for a DOE public school. Signed, Former MCS Parent
Yeah and they said at the PEP meeting just this week that he/DOE would be looking at it again. So it seems they’re willing to rethink that, which is good for the district since we need more capacity. Signed, random D3 resident who keeps up on these things
Actually, what they said at the meeting was “I will comment just to say that we did take a look at that building. As soon as we realized that it was available, we did take a look at the building. There are a number of problems, but we could discuss that offline with you. Okay. But we did take a look at it. We did follow up.” https://learndoe.org/pep/archive-pep-apr29-2026/
02:36:13
This is fair – I heard “there are a number of problems but we could discuss that offline” in context of knowing other info about the city’s willingness to revisit those problems, but I get that it could sound different on its own. It’s clear to me that building is back in the mix. We’ll see what happens.
The speaker he was responding to, and Rev Leticia Johnson who spoke on spending, are correct though. The DOE and SCA make short term decisions that end up costing more later. MCS is already a school building and most likely to be purchased by someone to use as one. If the city does not buy or lease it, and a charter school does, the DOE will be paying for it anyway – but for a charter instead of keeping it in the public schools. Or, if a private school buys and makes it fully accessible, or offers supports the DOE doesn’t ,the DOE will be spending on it through tuition reimbursement, further subsidizing private at the expense of public. The DOE ends up sending more and more and more money – and students! – to charters and private schools because they seem unable to look ahead past the tips of their nose. Rev Johnson’s comments on this problem in general were very relevant.
D3 parents, and all public school parents, should encourage longer-term more strategic thinking by the DOE. Their short-sighted budgetary decisions end up actively sending money and students *out* of the system to subsidize competing options, leaving less money to improve the public schools, and the vicious cycle continues. It won’t end until parents pull it together to advocate collectively for more sensible holistic planning.
Good idea, but as other commenters have said, the DoE doesn’t have the money to obtain the Manhattan Country School property, and it also lacks most of the key features that the Center School said were deal-breakers. It had already been reviewed and rejected as a possibility long ago in the process.
For that reason, it’s hard to imagine what good-faith reason there might have been for Gale Brewer and the Center School to announce they were co-hosting a press conference at the Manhattan Country School site about some new plan they had come up with, just days before the PEP was set to vote. But it’s pretty obvious why they cancelled and went radio silent on the “plan” once they got the district to back down. Not sure what comes next with the relocation, other than more delay.
The DOE absolutely has money to obtain school building, such as the Manhattan Country School. NYC School Construction Authority has $6.1 billion to spend on new capacity builds in the proposed budget to be voted on today by the PEP. This is public knowledge.
UWS Parent, you are either totally ignorant or have been fed fake news. I would guess you are in the PS 9 community based on your tone. Please understand that you don’t have all the information and to continue to sling mud at Center, a thriving and model school- one of the best the DOE has, and one that fought for its rights and due process (AND WON) is juvenile and myopic. You are embarrassing yourself at this point. Public discourse needs to shift to how to provide the best outcome for all students and families. Center not only fought for what was logical and just, they extended that effort to include the other schools on the proposals. Take a lesson from that.
Thanks for the response. If you have access to contradictory information, can you please share it rather than just crying “fake news”?
It’s no secret that the Center School views itself as a special community that sits above any other school in the city, and which shouldn’t have to make compromises. During community meetings, Center School speakers repeatedly insulted many other peer schools in the district (Frederick Douglass and Booker T. Washington to name a few) to make exactly the same point you are making. And as for tone, there’s only one group I can recall booing, jeering, and publicly attacking speakers from other schools during community meetings.
Also, come on: the Center School is not some savior that deigned to “extend its effort to include the other schools on the proposals.” The Center School opportunistically glommed onto other schools like Community Action School and Manhattan School for Children that were actually facing closure (not just moving 10 minutes down the road to a more racially-diverse location). Remember when a Center School parent made such vile racist statements toward a CAS student that the DOE withdrew the plan to close CAS, and then the Center School tried to capitalize and get its own proposal withdrawn at the same time?
The Center School is the fifth least-diverse Middle School in the entire city (and by far the least diverse school in District 3) based on DOE data, and it’s pretty obvious why they fought tooth-and-nail to avoid being colocated with a school that is less than 10% white and is near NYCHA housing, rather than with majority-white PS9. Gale Brewer’s comment in the article—that Center School does not feel PS/IS 191 is “in a place where they want to be”—seems to say the quiet part out loud.
I understand that you are upset. Your words matter.
Boos, jeers, public attacks – this did not happen. Video recordings of meetings are available online.
Many UWS families live in, and around, NYCHA housing. No one said anything about that during a meeting. So, what are you implying by bringing up NYCHA housing?
Center has explicitly said PS/IS 191 is not where they want to be because it lacks an auditorium and an outdoor yard comparable in size to their current yard. What quiet part are you insinuating?
Many Center families are also MSC families, so naturally they joined forces.
Center did not try to get its relocation proposal withdrawn when the DOE withdrew the CAS proposal.
What you are doing/saying here…you didn’t get the outcome you wanted, and you are very upset. And you’re having a hard to find somewhere to place that upset feeling. I see that you are very upset.
What a totally expected and unhinged reply. Your accusation about the Center School being racist is total propaganda at best and more accurately straight up slander. You’ve been fed a racially charged story line (most likely created by people with interests that suit only themselves) and you aren’t willing to look beyond it. You spend far too much time writing what you think are educated and witty comments on blogs like this when really you must just have a LOT of time on your hands and it makes me sad.
Your cortisol level is so high.
Wow, that’s a PS9 parent if ever I heard one.
1. Center was in discussions with 191, CAS and MSC as soon as these thoughtless proposals were issued. These proposals didn’t work for any of these schools. And Center didn’t want to have any part of displacing vulnerable students from 191.
2. Center is 40% black and brown. Not sure how that stacks up with other middle schools, but it was more diverse before the DOE stuck its nose into its admissions
3. The horrific remarks by a CS parent were made on probably the 10th call about getting these proposals withdrawn. The idea didn’t arise from the proposal for CAS closure getting withdrawn
4. Center has been very vocal about being open to any location (Harlem, east Harlem included) that has the right space for its curriculum
Get your facts straight!
Not sure any of that was actually a denial. But I’m assuming since it struck a nerve, you must be a Center School parent?
The PS/IS 191 building is a brand-new facility with space for close to 700 students, but it’s so severely under-enrolled right now that it could fit all ~250 Center School students without displacing any existing students, and still have space left over. Rather than all the performative outrage, couldn’t Center School have–ya know–spent a little of its time and energy advocating to keep those vulnerable 191 kids and integrate them into Center, instead of displacing them? I guess Center School parents didn’t focus on that option because they were too busy publicly mocking PS9’s 100+ IEP students for wanting to keep a single room for special ed services so they aren’t relegated to the middle of busy school hallways.
In all seriousness, if the Center School community is interested in rebuilding bridges with the families in the District that they alienated during this process, I’m all for it. I would be thrilled to see Center take the lead on finding a new home before fall 2027. I would also be thrilled to see Center make good on some of the promises they made during community meetings–e.g., to cede some extra classroom and gym space to relieve overcrowding at PS9 while we all try to find a better solution.
Again, need to get your facts straight:
1. The space proposed for Center in the 191 building was equal in terms of square footage to its current space, but had 12% less teaching space so it could not have accommodate the displaced 191 kids.
2. The DOE’s proposal was to disperse the 191 kids to schools throughout the district, not place them in Center.
3. Center has actively advocated for the vulnerable kids at 191 and continues to. PS9 parents never even mentioned them in the meetings
4. The Center community didn’t mock anyone in any of the meeting I was in, but they did call out the ableist attitudes of some PS9 families who seem to think kids should be ashamed of needing services and should be hidden away. Ditto for the entitled attitudes, as one PS9 dad said “fine for other schools to provide IEP services in common spaces, but not for our kids”
5. Center has already proposed a few sites – Brandeis, 165, a location on the east side among others
6. Center admin suggested giving space to PS 9 before the EISs were even issued. The DOE rejected that idea, not Center.
I don’t mean to generalize to the entire PS9 parent community as most of the ones I have spoken to are pretty embarrassed by the few vocal ones whose entitlement is cringeworthy. While the other affected schools commented about their communities as a whole and acknowledged the other schools facing closure, this PS9 group only spoke about their own kids. And no one from PS9 acknowledged that these proposals would require displacing the kids from 191. I imagine the attitudes of these people were a big part of these proposals getting pulled – it wouldn’t have been a good look for the DOE to side with them. It seems to me those are the people that need to work on rebuilding bridges….
Sorry–your position is really that parents of 5 year-olds with serious OT and PT needs are ABLEIST because they don’t want their kids being distracted and jostled in school hallways while support staff tries in vain to sustain some level of services?
Spoken with the true privilege of someone who has clearly never faced a moment of hardship, or ever even met a student who has special needs. Of course you would out yourself as one of those parents, and of course you would just double down now. So much for building bridges.
Nope. Wrong. Kid had learning challenges and had to get IEP services onscreen because of COVID. So I’m happy to talk about distraction. PS9 kids have had the advantage of in-person learning which current middle schoolers didn’t have consistently thanks to the pandemic. So in-person IEP services sound pretty good whether you are hiding them away or doing it in the open. And most PS9 classes have more than one teacher. Plus they have an art room, a book room, a STEM/robotics room while most NYC elementary schools would welcome just one of the above.
Read the room: no one feels sorry for the PS9 parents who have been complaining. Instead of trying to convince readers here, you would do well to watch recordings of some of the meetings with officials and pay attention to how PS9 sounded compared with the other communities.
PS: regarding gnyour hardship comment: kid had serious accident, I’ve battled cancer, partner hospitalized for serious mental
Health issues…..
Just to add here that I don’t view any challenges my family has faced as entitling us to displace to another school community. It entitles us to nothing.
What the poster might be referring to is that at a CEC3 meeting, PS 9 parents and educators spoke about the stigma of receiving IEP services in view of other students. As a parent of a child with an IEP and a learning difference, I found this line of comments harmful as well. Stigma doesn’t not attach in an inclusive environment where differences are normalized.
You state known inaccuracies with such certitude, it’s really stunning. As you surely know, Center School is an all-school mixed-grade model. The PS 191 building does NOT have adequate space for Center School’s existing students unless 191’s middle schoolers are displaced, which is why (1) the EISs clearly said that Center’s resisting was contingent on 192’s truncation, (2) the DOE did not propose a merger, and (3) the DOE was proposing absurdities like using space at Juilliard and recess almost a half mile away for Center’s daily use.
Additionally, 191 did not want to be subsumed into Center – and certainly didn’t want it in a model where Centers existing curriculum doesn’t work!. They want to keep their K-8 community and have the DOE provide the resources they are supposed to have received. So no, Center was not going to speak over them and advocate for something that they did not want. Why would you even think that would be appropriate? Center advocated – and will continue to advocate – for the DOE to listen to them, and MSC and CAS.
You seem to be willfully obscuring that Center is a middle school with kids from virtually all elementary schools in the district. It has families who went to 191 and MSC, as well as 9. It has real relationships with – and first-hand information from – families who are or were at those schools. When “Center families” advocate for “191 families” or “MSC families,” they are doing so from a position of actual connection, care and listening. Incidentally, every Center School family that came from 9 or has a younger kid currently at 9 was shocked at how PS9 acted through all of this, and many “silent” PS9 families have since reached out to say how ridiculous the manufactured urgency was. It would have been helpful if they had spoken publicly while the proposals were pending, but they have said they were bullied and silenced by the vocal contingent and admin. Center’s relationships across the district are strong – and will continue to strengthen as the plans get reworked. PS9 on the other hand may want to think about how it repairs relationships with the families outside its own building, since your kids will one day be classmates with many of theirs.
I was imagining during the meetings how the vocal group of PS9 parents would have reacted if it had been proposed that their kids walk half a mile for recess or schlep to another school for the auditorium. That would have been something to see!
Your children are middle schools children. This does not equate!!
Got it — I’m hearing that you’re happy to cast yourself as the white knight and savior for other school communities when it just so happens to benefit the self-interest of privileged Center School parents, but willing to mock and deride vulnerable kids at other schools who stand in the way of getting what Center parents want. It’s pretty telling that none of the families from CAS, MSC, or 191 took the same tone.
You know, I haven’t commented on any of the articles during this debacle because I don’t like to pour fuel on a fire. But as a Center School parent of a kid who needed a lot of services in an elementary school that was not well-resourced like PS 9, and who continues to receive services at Center, I feel like I need to respond to your outbursts here. Through all the meetings and hearings, it’s been awful and harmful to witness how nasty (some?) PS 9 parents are to Center School kids with needs and their families, and how you care only about your own and kick dirt at everyone else.
I don’t have the bandwidth some of y’all do to write it all out, but I have commiserated with PS 9’s fears while also sharing about my kid’s needs and how the proposed relocation would be harmful. PS 9 responded by dismiss those needs and concerns without a shred of empathy. Your collective message? My middle schooler’s needs can never matter as much as your kids’ – and actually my concerns are fake and I’m just a privileged racist (if only you knew anything about me). Same lack of empathy for kids at RSMA, some who aren’t getting any services they need, in hallways or anywhere, because they can’t even get evaluated.. Not a drop off empathy for them either. I’m getting upset just thinking about it. My friends at Center who know more people at PS 9 tell me there are some nicer people there, and maybe they’re right, but if so they sure kept themselves hidden through all this.
The people who spoke out from PS9 really have a shocking lack of self-awareness. The lack of consideration and empathy for anyone but their own kids was jaw-dropping in those meetings. I really don’t know how the DOE could have made a case for siding with PS9 after their performance. Clearly it didn’t help them in the end.
I understand that you care deeply about your child.
I don’t recall anyone mocking or deriding children at PS 9. The video recordings of public meetings are online.
It’s tough to be in a public school system with finite resources. In an ideal world, all schools would have their needs met. But, sadly, that is not the reality in NYC. Sometimes, a school may have to get in line behind another when waiting for resources. Waiting to relocate Center to a site other than one currently occupied by 191 does not sound unreasonable.
Since Center has been vocal about identifying other relocation sites, perhaps the 9 community could push for one of those relocation options? If the goal is to get Center out, help them – this helps your cause as well.
No idea how you got white knight and savior from what I wrote. Schools and communities advocating together and for each other is a good thing. Center didn’t save the other schools; Center worked with them to collectively shine light on all the flaws and problems. No saviors, just communities supporting each other. It’s sad that makes you so angry.
I also don’t know where you got that I mocked or derided any child at any school, as I never did that. Never have, never would.
While I hadn’t expressed it above, it’s true that I didn’t understand why PS 9 (adults, not children) would have turned down extra space that was offered by Center, or would choose to push services for vulnerable children into hallways ahead of repurposing administrative offices or specials rooms, and I’m very familiar with how much is possible with the space that PS9 does have so I do know that was a choice reflecting priorities. , But I never spoke derisively of any child at any school, or diminished any of their needs. Yet I hear you still having no empathy at all for children at MSC or 191, (even leaving aside the Center School kids whose needs you dismiss as well).
It’s also worth noting that PS 191, MSC and CAS all advocated for Center as well, as did leaders in D4, D30, and PSPNY (including at last night’s PEP meeting), As much as PS9 (and the DOE) seem to want to frame this cynically and as merely opportunistic, parents at the schools were all experiencing the same gaslighting from the district and others, and have common cause in improving the process and outcomes for everyone. There are many instances to point to, but just seeing how CAS parents continued to advocate – including for Center School – even after the DOE scrapped their closure, while PS9 families couldn’t even acknowledge the harms to PS 191 or MSC families, should maybe make parents like UWS Parent think a bit more reflectively about how the process played out and what they’re claiming and defending.
Edit to my comment: likely obvious, but “the EISs clearly said that Center’s resisting was contingent on 192’s truncation” had autocorrects/typos and was meant to say “Center’s re-siting was contingent on 191’s truncation.”
What are you talking about? This is the problem. More hatred rather than working together. The Center parents who are continually rude and nasty towards PS9 are not OK. I’m frankly surprised WSR even published a post with this type of tone – “embarrassing yourself?” Really.
Things worked out well for Center. Let’s work together to figure out a long term solution, and figure it out sooner rather than later. Center can be part of the problem or part of the solution. The attitude of the Center School parents who post here seems very different from the philosophy of kindness that I thought was the backbone of the school.
Leon, I’m curious why you saw the second comment as nasty or bad tone, but not the comment that person was responding to where the whole second paragraph is accusing Center families of bad faith and insinuating something nefarious (though I’m not sure what). Just as I didn’t understand why “Beth” assumes your comments about Anderson are bad faith. Everyone should take the temperature down and focus on merits of various options not ad hominem attacks, but it’s odd to ignore the provoking comment and focus only on the response.
That building is millions and the DOE already said there is no money and no plan to purchase any property. It also needs massive amounts of work.
39 million dollars without an auditorium and a yard and not co-located with an elementary school…
The Manhattan Country School site, which was proposed as “an elegant solution” by Gale Brewer, is an ideal spot for Center School.
Center School would be able to access,, via an existing hallway between the buildings, the outdoor yard and auditorium at Brandeis. Center School could also grow there, which would be xcellent for District 3 families.
Center School would also be, by association and proximity, co-located with the Upper West Success Academy charter, which plans to shrink to a K to 4th grade school at that site next year. Center School, starting at 5th grade, could welcome those charter students back into the public schools, which is a goal of the Chancellor.
In the Manhattan Country School, there would even be space for additional Pre_k seats, if PS 9 wanted to open more seats to elementary age students or to expand their excellent arts and science offerings. Moving Center School to 85th Street improves both schools, and is better for District 3 overall.
Love this bigger-picture win-win-win thinking! This also gives RSMA breathing room to improve with the resources they were supposed to have received, and relieves space pressure that was limiting options for solving other overcrowded schools (still need to figure out O’Shea, JoA, WESS, any others?). THIS is the kind of perspective the DOE should be offering
You have incorrect information. It’s better to stay quiet when you don’t know things.
twice now you have accused people of posting incorrect information yet in neither of your responses have you posted anything to counter their assertions or provide us what you think is the correct information. Sometimes its better to back up assertions with facts rather than be accusatory.
Well congrats to the families that were able to move the powers that be to pause this mess of a process! Very rare for the DOE to pull proposals so something got to them! I’m cynical but hope the DOE means it when they say they will listen to families this time. I also hope they’ll make it a bigger conversation about how to improve and maintain a variety of school options in the district even with limited space and resources. Nothing good comes from treating it as zero-sum and pitting schools against each other – all families have an interest in holding the DOE to a higher standard than what we saw this past year
Not rare to pull proposals. Happens all the time. D2 has it happen often.
This is incorrect. They pull back ideas that are in discussion phase before making a proposal, but once a proposal is officially made, which means the DOE has published an EIS and started the A-190 process towards a vote, it is extremely rare. What are examples of that happening often in D2, or anywhere?
And … crickets from “Smart Mom” lol.
But yeah this is totally right: .they almost never withdraw proposals after hearings, they just pressure PEP to vote yes. All the stuff the chancellor said in his statement about the timeline and family engagement hadnt stopped him until now, so something or someone else got to him. Families mentioned some illegalities at the public hearings – maybe there was something to that or else some political pressure. Raises questions! We’ll never know but hopefully the result is a better approach next go-round.
“all families have an interest in holding the DOE to a higher standard than what we saw this past year.” Yes! **ALL**
I do have children at schools involved here but I have been telling all my friends with children in elementary and even Pre-K that they need to really be paying attention right now.
I would urge all D3 public elementary and early childhood parents to write to Dr. Higgens, Chancellor Samuels, and to the Mayor asking for a transparent and detailed plan, formed with our communities, that looks forward to solve these challenges for the future of D3 middle schools while also respecting the needs of the real human students currently attending them.
The middle school not moving was orchestrated by Gale Brewer, scourge of the UWS community and the epitome of why Mayoral Control should have been abolished as promised by the mayor. Chancellor Samuels and Mayor Mamdani should be ashamed. Total gutless disappointments lacking the political will to help children. So should Gale be ashamed, but she won’t be. She’s waiting for the graduation photo ops, nothing else. The rest of us are waiting til she’s term-limited out and Mamdani finishes what looks to be his first and only term.
What do you mean by help children?
Middle schoolers are also children.
The rushed nature of the proposals would harm children at 4 schools (remember CAS only received a temporary pause as well) to benefit 1 (or 2 but Lafayette did not really speak up at all in any of this so I’m not sure if they actually need help or if the district just wants them to expand).
When we shuffle kids around suddenly every few years it creates a lack of stability in their lives, disrupts learning, anderodes trust in public schools.
Let us make a long-term plan to do right by all the children in our schools now and in the future.
Dude, as just one example, in what world would closing MSC middle school with no alternatives in place for kids with significant disabilities “help children”? Many more children stood to be hurt by these proposals on this timeline. The ones you should be mad at are the DOE for a completely botched approach that didn’t even plan for where kids would go when their schools were closed. Why not expect the DOE to do better by ALL kids?
I’ll bet residents will have nothing to say about this and the DOE holds all the cards.
Isnt putting something to a vote, win or lose, in actuality running things democratically?
Not when the PEP vote is known to be a rubber-stamp. I think PEP has voted against DOE proposals only 2 times in the last 15 years!! It’s a joke. (And if I missed one or two, it’s no less of a joke!) PEP members are almost all mayoral appointees and it’s an open secret that they were being told they had to vote in favor of these proposals. The whole process is a sham, which is why I keep saying ALL parents have an interest in demanding better.
Can’t they just open a new school without closing others?
What was supposed to happen to all the children who attend/are zoned for PS 191? Also how would all this have impacted PS 452 which shares zoning areas with 191?
That was a big part of the issue. They were just planning to closes 191’s middle school and place the students in any D3 middle school that had space for them. A significant number of them are from asylum-seeking families and school may have been the most stability they have had. So a 7th grader whose family has been living in a shelter and is still learning English could suddenly find themselves at Booker where they know no one. Dispersing them throughout the district would have been a convenient way for the DOE to dilute the track record of failing these kids.
Great questions. You’d think a proposal would have included some answers to them, but it didn’t! The DOE’s response whenever asked was basically “trust us, we’ll figure it out, later.” I can’t understand how anyone’s ok with closure proposals that don’t include any info about what will happen to the kids or the impact on surrounding schools. Keep an eye on it in the fall when they prepare to redo the proposals!! Show up and ask questions EARLY and OFTEN!
I listened to the endless PEP meeting yesterday and, oh man, CEC3 should be embarrassed!
Scuttlebut is also that both PS9 and Lafayette overextended offers for the fall based on all the private confident assurances from CEC leaders that the proposals were a done deal. So! Not only did CEC3 fail MSC, CAS, RSMA and Center by being the voicebox of the DOE instead of advocates for families, they ALSO failed PS9 and Lafayette by treating the process as just for show (which yeah it would’ve been if DOE hadn’t gotten scared by something and pulled them before the vote).
When are the next CEC3 elections?! lol
CEC 3 co-presidents Rackmill and Savov served as rubber stamps for the District 3 superintendency and the Chancellor.
Even in the end, after hours of testimony, when it was clear that CEC3 couldn’t vote FOR the 4 proposals, the CEC3 leadership still couldn’t be full-throated in their opposition to it. They backed the 4 deeply flawed proposals out of blind loyalty to the chancellor and D3 superintendency., and they tried to do what they’d been told to do until the bitter end.
Time for a change in CEC3.
Two words appropos. Home. Schooling. (To an extent possible. Remember the very important point is -your kids).